Politics in the Church of God impedes progress
Many Sabbath-keeping Church of God members (various groups and organizations associated to one degree or another with Herbert W. Armstrong) are sincerely opposed to offering any Church of God literature or religious material for sale, as Herbert Armstrong taught us to “buy the truth and don’t sell it.” However, such members of the Church of God must to remember that Mr. Armstrong subsequently made his books available for sale in bookstores, informing the brothers and collaborators in a letter dated September 12, 1985:
“There is a very large audience that would never ask for this book [Mystery of the Ages] if it were offered free, that you would never send us your name and address, but would gladly buy a copy at the bookstore. By putting it in bookstores we will reach a very large audience that we cannot reach in any other way. We won’t be selling the book ourselves, but it can’t be made available to this large audience of book buyers unless bookstores put a price on it.”Autobiography of Herbert W. Armstrong, Volume 2, page 638).
Some are angry because Beyond Babylon: The Rise and Fall of Europe It is sold. I remind you of Herbert Armstrong’s words above and Paul’s rhetorical response to some in his day on this principle that we are commanded not to muzzle the ox while threshing and that a laborer is worthy of his wages. Besides, Beyond Babylon is available for FREE or to read online for FREE. God knows I’m certainly not in this for the money, but I gladly share the plain truth of the Bible and history as best I can, knowing that it is truly priceless information.
I am also an individual, not a Church organization that receives titles and regular offerings and therefore has no need to sell anything, as they are equipped to offer it all, ideally for free. I do not believe that any Church of God organization should sell Church of God literature. However, those in the field, who are not part of the administration or headquarters, have a God-given right to do whatever is necessary. Yeshua did not condemn the sale of sacrificial animals, but he was rightly incensed that such commercial activities took place in the Temple courts and at exorbitant prices. Many were making a killing instead of offering a service.
A member of the Philadelphia Church of God recently wrote to me about this and other Church of God topics.
Did he not try to impose his book on the ministers and the church of God?
No problem. Gerald Flurry refused to go through with Beyond Babylon and fell backwards, stepping on old ground and now goes in circles, as usual, while Europe rises and Judah and Israel have not yet been warned.
Maybe you should have waited until the time came.
Don’t you think that God goes first to His Church and then to His Nation? It was time to bring Beyond Babylon before Flurry, who I consider to be the leader of this Laodicean era of the Church of God.
Do you think you are one of the 2 witnesses?
God knows, but what I do know is that we must at least prepare the way for them with Judah and NONE of the Church of God groups come to the cities of Judah.
It would be an honor to be one. I have often prayed for them and in my stupidity wished I could be one of them.
It would be a serious honor and responsibility and the most hated job in the world as it would be the rejection of many in the Church, initially, and almost everyone, with a bloody end until the resurrection to physical life just before the return. of the King, Yeshua the Messiah. No nice dinners or fancy invitations for the Two Witnesses, but plenty of murderous misunderstandings and hateful grievances.
But I’m just a lay member…
There is no such thing as “just” a lay member. Everyone has their God-given place in God’s Church and is equally important to what God has called them to do.
It seems to me that you focus too much on physical Jews.
No problem. Herbert Armstrong always told us that “WATCH JERUSALEM!” Who is in Jerusalem? JEWS! The gospel began and will return there. The true church of God is not there now even though “Elijah” went there. This must change.
Mr. Armstrong, near the time of his death, said in one of his sermons or Bible studies that they are not as important as they once thought, since they don’t even believe in Jesus Christ.
I don’t think so at all and I don’t think he ever said it. I quote what we know for sure that Herbert Armstrong said about the importance of reaching the cities of Judah. It’s documented. Shamefully, it is something that has not yet been done but the foundations have been laid, although the Work in Israel is temporarily suspended by government decree as it was in the days of Ezra and Nehemiah.
Mr. Flurry never read your book, did he?
I don’t know. Wayne Turgo [Gerald Flurry’s son-in-law] she gave him a printout years ago and he sent it back saying, “She’s always sending us stuff.” Mr. Flurry even responded to me several times on various topics, including his confusion of Mount Carmel with Mount Hermon, which I pointed out to him (having been wounded to live alongside both), and my disagreement with him when he said that the Pope was the only religious leader who sat on a throne and I mentioned that the Queen of England is also the head of the Anglican Church (although I agree with the point you were making against Roman Catholic worship).
I would love to find those letters, however, during my many moves to Israel, I thought I had them stored in my sister’s house, but she can’t find them. Such letters also include correspondence from Dr. Herman Hoeh years ago about the Jews and their color variations and why. I met Dr. Hoeh at Toronto Singles Weekend (singles from all over the Church of God attended) where he spoke and invited us to write to him, which of course I did.
Later I sent an autographed copy of a self-published Bed and breakfast (Beyond Babylon) to Flurry’s house for him and his wife, who told me (during the Feast of Tabernacles in Louisville) about my name: “What a strong name Judah!”
Dennis Leap said he read parts of it and there was no need for him or Flurry to read it, unlike Mr. Armstrong who wanted Sardis (Church of God, Seventh Day) to read his manuscript: United States and Great Britain in prophecy – what they did.
Well, I hear you loud and clear. I don’t agree with some of the headquarters decisions, but they are as human as we are and can make mistakes, including Mr. Flurry. Sometimes we just have to suffer the evil and move on.
I readily accept and acknowledge that fact, but if it is a mistake or a sin, we learn from it, acknowledge it, and move on with more wisdom. Flurry hasn’t done any of those humble things. Anyway, I’m still without him as he backs off trying to play HWA and God in the Temple, it pains me to say.
David, I hope and pray for your return to PCG… Mr. Flurry has been involved in personal appearance campaigns and I think he plans to go to Joseph and Judah next year. the key of david It will no longer be broadcast on television and we are now focusing on personal warnings.
Remember that we are baptized into the Body of Jesus Christ, not into any sect or denomination of men. I remain a member of the spiritual Church of God which is not subject to membership rolls at the mercy of men. Do you remember Diotrephes? (3 John verses 9-11).
What do you mean that they have written off television programs (although I have always criticized them constructively, via Wayne Turgeon, who used to write to me very often, that no one except a very limited religious audience would watch the programs at the times that were displayed). As Turgeon can testify, I also said they needed a toll-free number (which they got years later); I said they needed a website with Church literature (which they have years later); need to post Beyond Babylon freely (which they still don’t) and take out ads in major newspapers like HWA to reach EVERYONE and get EVERYONE talking about our controversial God-given message.
We really need better advertising.
Yes, because I did my own tests and surveys on many internet forums to see that the general public has no idea who Flurry is, has never heard of PCG, and doesn’t know the warning message at all. All that money for what? A private club?
Too bad you only see what you think is bad, but God has to prepare his family first to marry his Son before he can properly deal with the world.
And how does God do that? Have we looked at the navel of our Church – the seat of the Church as the center of our attention? – or by the way of giving, overflowing concern for the good and well-being of OTHERS – like the cities of Judah. Otherwise, people will never feel ready to reach out and they will have proven to be deceived by Satan, who does not want the Work to GO AHEAD. As we draw closer, God help us, He will work in us and through us at the same time.
I know all that is good about PCG and continue to direct people to their literature and The Philadelphia Trumpet magazine despite his refusal to send it to me. They even know that I have given them contacts in the Middle East, in Jerusalem, Jewish leaders, and that it was me that God used to contact the mayor of Jerusalem to repair the HWA monument (in Liberty Bell Park in Jerusalem), and then I sent the information to Flurry (who didn’t even thank me and wasn’t even aware of his sorry neglect that I knew from being there so many times). I bet you didn’t know that, right?
He had written an open letter to the mayor of Jerusalem, Uri Lupolianski, which was published in The Jerusalem Post. His office contacted me to ask what groups or organizations I was referring to that would be interested in taking financial responsibility for the restoration of the monument and the rest is history.